Very hard water, how do members here manage it?

[DuzMano]

So looking at my water suppliers info, I have "very hard water" almost pushing 400ppm of calcium carbonate and nearly 300ppm of general hardness. Nuts eh?

To my uneducated brain I'm thinking rainwater harvesting would be the way to go, but in times of drought etc which is becoming more common, this might not always be possible. So how do members here deal with living in hard water areas that perhaps don't want to do the investment in RO go about managing their hard water?

[fr499y]

I did have around 25 degrees German at one point which is mental, snails and guppies where ok though

RO water os the better way to manage it, or stock fish that prefer the harder water.

[plankton]

Rainbows and some of the rasbora will be ok in hard water, as will x-ray (pristella) tetras. Livebearers are the usual go-to for hard water, with smaller tanks you'll be looking at limia, guppies, endlers or platies (you won't get anything bigger in a small tank). Some of the smaller rainbows are really pretty (forktails, celebes and gertrudes).
The gourami will be out in hard water, they are way too difficult to keep in it nowadays.

[Martinspuddle]

So looking at my water suppliers info, I have "very hard water" almost pushing 400ppm of calcium carbonate and nearly 300ppm of general hardness. Nuts eh?

That's pretty much most of the UK, there are exceptions, bonnie Scotland being one.

To my uneducated brain I'm thinking rainwater harvesting would be the way to go, but in times of drought etc which is becoming more common, this might not always be possible. So how do members here deal with living in hard water areas that perhaps don't want to do the investment in RO go about managing their hard water?

There are many ways to soften our 'iron water' as I like to call it but all depends on which fish species your planning to keep. Problem with rain water is reliability. With the droughts we've had in past years, there no guarantee of a constant supply. RO water can be expensive or a pain to have to lug heavy cans home every week. Woods like bogwood, soil substrates and botanicals or adding aquarium-safe peat moss or peat pellets to your filter will all help to lower the hardness within the aquarium. Many fish species will live in our hard water and most you'll find in your local aquatic store will kept in local tap water but the problem is their longevity. Over time calcium deposits build up in their organs and eventually cause death.

For a beginner there are quite a few fish species you can keep without altering the tap water too much ...so in no particular order;

Endler (Poecilia Wingei)
Guppy (Poecilia reticulata)
Platy (Xiphophorus maculatus)
Molly (Poecilia sphenops)
Swordtail (Xiphophorus hellerii)
Celebes Rainbowfish (Marosatheria ladigesi)
McCulloch's rainbowfish (Melanotaenia maccullochi)
Threadfin rainbowfish (Iriatherina werneri)
Neon dwarf rainbowfish (Melanotaenia praecox)
New Guinea rainbowfish (Melanotaenia affinis)
Lake Kutubu rainbowfish (Melanotaenia lacutris)
Boesmani rainbowfish (Melanotaenia boesemani)
Australian rainbowfish (Melanotaenia fluviatilis)
Forktail blue-eye rainbowfish (Pseudomugil furcatus)
Neon blue-eye rainbowfish (Pseudomugil cyanodorsalis)
Popondetta rainbowfish (Pseudomugil connieae)
X-ray tetra (Pristella maxillaris)
Congo tetra (Phenamogrammus interruptus)
Black widow tetra (Gymnocorymbus ternetzi)
False penguin tetra (Thayeria boehlkei)
Red eye tetra (Moenkhausia sanctaefilomenae)
Glass bloodfin tetra (Prionobrama filigera)
Florida flagfish (Jordanella floridae)
Odessa barb (Pethia padamya)
Cherry barb (Puntius titteya)
Rosy barb (Pethia conchonius)
Golden barb (Barbodes semifasciolatus)
Indian glassfish (Parambassis ranga)
Inle danio (Inlecypris auropurpurea)
Emerald dwarf rasbora (Celestichthys erythromicron)
Red dwarf rasbora (Microrasbora rubescens)
Asian rummynose (Sawbwa resplendens)
Wrestling halfbeak (Dermogenys pusilla)
Zebra danio (Brachydanio rerio)
Glowlight Danio (Celestichtys choprae)
Pearl danio (Brachydanio albolineatus)
Inle Loach (Petruichthys brevis)
Dwarf lake synodontis or False Cuckoo (Synodontis petricolaa)
White cloud mountain minnow (Tanichthys albonubes)
Paradise fish (Macropodus operculis)
Puntius Barb (Puntius snyderi)
Empire gudgeon (Hypseleotris compressa)

I'm in no doubt I've missed some somewhere ...someone here will add to the list but my fingers are starting to get sore!

There other fish species but for larger aquariums, like African Cichlids, Central American Cichlids and what we call 'tank busters' anything over 10" inches. Some livebearers I haven't listed as they are not readily available in the trade and some fish species don't mix with others like the Paradise fish (Macropodus operculis) and the Dwarf lake synodontis (Synodontis petricolaa)

As a newbie to get your feet wet and depending on your aquarium size of course, I'd suggest small Barbs, Danios, livebearers and Tetras listed.

If your not sure, ask and never buy on impulse!

[DuzMano]

That looks a long and comprehensive list regardless of sore fingers or not! Thank you so much for this. Bog woods and botanicals were definitely on the list as I'm going for the natural look, so it's reassuring to know these will help somewhat. I'm almost pretty sure I'll be going for the leddy XL 60, unless I find a local second hand bargain fluval roma 90 or similar, might be lucky... The leddy also has a filter that isn't hard integrated into the tank, it's completely detachable/removable so I could swap this out if it's inappropriate for whatever reason, which is a plus. Some idea of what I should be looking for substrate wise could be helpful additional info, or will it be clearly explained on the packaging? I was going to go with some regular aquatic compost mixed with some course gravel in mesh bags to build an undulating kind of surface and cap it off with some mix of fine earthy coloured gravel with some courser lighter gravel for accenting some areas. I'm still wondering what Asian bottom dweller I could have I did have my heart set on kuhli loaches however they prefer warmer and more neutral water I think and also a group big enough to be happy might be too many fish for a tank with a 60 x 30ish footprint. I'd like cherry shrimp too but fancy they'll be expensive food for the paradise fish I also have my heart set on keeping with wcmms...I may still get a small group established before introducing the fish and see how they get on.

Also will the water hardness have a large impact of what plants would thrive?

[Martinspuddle]

Cap the soil and gravel with sand. See here: https://www.aquariumforums.co.uk/viewto ... &start=120 (sixth post onwards)

Also will the water hardness have a large impact of what plants would thrive?

You ask, I post. ...these are all hardy, low light, easy to grow plants.

African Water Fern - Bolbitis heudelotii
Anubias barteri - Anubias barteri v. barteri
Anubias barteri 'marble' - Anubias barteri 'marble'
Anubias barteri v. 'glabra' - Anubias barteri v. 'glabra'
Anubias nana - Anubias barteri v. 'nana'
Bacopa - Bacopa caroliniana
Brazilian Pennywort - Hydrocotyle leucocephala
Bucephalandra 'Kedagang'
Ceylon Hygro - Hygrophila polysperma 'Ceylon'
Coffee leaf anubias - Anubias barteri v. 'coffeefolia'
Cryptocoryne Balansae
Cryptocoryne aponogetifolia
Cryptocoryne retrospiralis
Cryptocoryne spiralis
Cryptcoryne becketii 'Petchii'
Cryptcoryne Wentii
Cryptocoryne usteriana
Cabomba aquatica
Echinodorus bleheri 'Tropica' aka 'amazonicus'
Egeria densa - Brazilian waterweed
Golden nana - Anubias barteri v. 'nana golden'
Guppy Grass - Najas guadalupensis
Hornwort - Ceratophylum demersum
Hygrophila - Hygrophila polysperma ‘Green’
Hygrophila - Hygrophila polysperma 'Rosanervig'
Java Moss - Vesicularia dubyana
Java Fern - Microsorum pteropus
Lilaeopsis brasiliensis
Limnophila sessiliflora
Moneywort, Water Hyssop - Bocapa monnieri
Narrow leaf nana - Anubias barteri v. 'nana narrow leaf
Narrow Leaf Java Fern - Microsorum pteropus v. 'narrow leaf'
Parrots Feather - Myriophyllum aquaticum
Petite nana - Anubias barteri v. nana 'petite'
Pygmy Crypt - Cryptocoryne pygmaea
Pelia - Monosolenium tenerum
Philippine Java Fern - Microsorum pteropus 'Philippine'
Downoi - Pogostemon helferi
Red Java fern - Microsorum pteropus "red"
Rotala Rotundifolia - Rotala rotundifolia
Rotala rotundifolia sp. 'Green'
Rotala Indica - Rotala indica
Vallisneria americana 'Natans'
Waterwheel Plant - Aldrovanda vesiculosa
Cryptocoryne parva
Vallisneria americana - var. biwaensis
Water lettuce - Pistia stratiotes
Amazon Frogbit - Limnobium laevigatum

Give sufficient nutrients and low to medium light these plants all grow.

[DuzMano]

Double posted, sorry

[DuzMano]

If there isn't already a forum title for "king of lists" then there should be and it be bestowed upon you for eternity haha

That's some excellent info, I'll check them all out and see what is endemic to the areas of the fish I'm hoping to keep and also give the visual appearance I'm seeking. The bulk of the planting I'm looking to use will be simulating a corner of a rice paddy where it meets a wilder, natural area, so I'm after something like a tall, thin leaved aquatic plant... Unless I can actually grow rice plants? Lol I'm kinda looking at java ferns and something stemmy yet narrow for the sides and back and java moss and with a few crypts, buce and Anubis for the shadier areas and in, around and on the hardscape items, with some Asian variant of micro sword dotted nearer the front?

Some floating plants too, but something manageable mini water lettuce maybe? and a few botanicals and twiggy bits to simulate leaf litter...

I dare say all not very unique or original, but looking forward to getting started.

[DuzMano]

Liking the look of that vallisneria, Australian, but it's almost Asia haha

[Martinspuddle]

Bare in mind your aquatic plants will need feeding, so daily fertiliser dosing or root fertiliser tablets are needed.

Your starting to sound like you'll need to think about a larger aquarium than the 54 to 72 litre aquariums you've been considering.